Ask the experts

[SamanthaLenkic]

Hi Rachel and Kristen,

I wanted to ask a question about career changes and how a career change will trigger many different life decisions/opportunities – first a bit of background: I am really thinking of changing my career completely, I’ve worked in public relations and communications for 5+ years but I’ve had a lot of blows in the industry – redundancies, agencies that made me hate my life by under-resourcing that led to working ridiculously long hours (I’m a 100% Thriver so I NEED work life balance) and the latest blow came just before last Christmas. I thought I had found a PR job where I was really happy, but then was let go during my trial period – unpacking the situation with a counsellor has led me to find a lot of the situation was likely related to money in the business and I was the easiest team member to let go of.

Over the last year I have been really considering a career in Dietetics and Nutrition, I find health particularly how food relates to health, has always been a keen interest of mine – I read all about it in my spare time. I also love the idea of helping people get healthier with food, both mentally and physically. Plus my own Grandma was able to get back on track when a dietitian helped her gain weight after having her teeth removed, I’d love to help people in that way – and I’ve started to feel that PR while a fun profession has always been a bit superficial. Additionally I feel a lot of my blows in this industry is because the industry is shrinking (like journalism) and the money is not in the industry that it once was, so I worry about how the industry will look in 10 years time.

Now I’m 28, and I’m at the cusp of making a lot of other big life decisions – I’m halfway towards saving for a house deposit, my partner and I are ready to move in together, we talk about doing things like travel, having a baby, buying a place to live and he also would like to do an MBA.

I know I’m not old, but I think about the 5 years a dietitian course will take… I feel this decision would be a lot easier if I was 21! So now I’m having all these questions, should I keep saving for a house deposit and buy a house? Should I study? Should my partner and I travel since he hasn’t had the travel the world experience? Should we have a baby?

I’m torn between staying on the path I’m on now in PR which will lead me to buying a property and having a baby, or jump into something I feel is my passion and that I’m called to but will potentially put that other path on ‘hold.’

[Rachel E]

Hey Samantha,

It’s understandable that you feel torn! It sounds like you’re dealing with something that many of us struggle with — wanting “it all,” but feeling like you can’t have it all at the same time.

So, one of the ways I like to look at big life questions is to zoom WAY far out and ask myself, “What would I regret NOT having done when I’m 80?” Like, when I’m really old and thinking back on my life, what things would seem silly to me for having done/not done?

Would your 80-year-old self want you to stay in PR, given how you feel about it right now? What would she have to say about having a baby later than you may have originally foreseen? What would she say about buying a house and traveling? Honestly, it may be good to write down a back-and-forth conversation with yourself on this! Channel your inner wise old woman and have a chat with yourself about what matters to you, and what’s worth it, and what makes life worth living, in the end.

That said, I wonder if you need to explore the dietician route more. Right now, it sounds like you’re pretty sure it’s going to take 5 years. And that’s a long time, for sure! But could there be other programs that are similar, but don’t eat up so much time? Maybe there’s a way to express your passion for this subject, just in a different way that isn’t so time-consuming. I would exhaust ALL of your options before assuming that pursuing your passion will take up that much time. Because maybe it doesn’t have to be as “either/or” as you’re assuming right now.

Also, keep this in mind — If you’re not happy in your career, which is where you spend the majority if your waking hours, having a house and a baby may or may not “make up” for the lack of fulfillment you feel at work. It may put more stress on you and your relationship — “Now I HAVE to stay in this career that I don’t love, and I feel even more trapped, because now I have a mortgage and a kid and I can’t easily escape.” In general, I’d always recommend thinking long and hard before committing to a path that you already know doesn’t light you up, because you think it’s the only way to get other things that you want out of life. I’m a big believer that we can always find a way to have BOTH. It may not be all at the same time, and it may require more creative thinking, stretching, and experimenting, but having everything you want IS possible.

Let me know what you think! 🙂

[SamanthaLenkic]

Hi Rachel,

Thank you for the advice! That is really good advice, I had a chat with my 80 year old self 😉 and this is what she had to say:

“What? You think 28 is too old to change careers? Ha! That is crazy talk, especially when your instincts about the PR industry were right and it’s only going to get more stressful and continue to shrink. Being a travel agent was a great job in the 80s but that all changed with the internet, PR’s likely going to go that way too – and you know studying lights you up and health science will likely be less demanding and allow you to work more reasonable hours than PR – perfect for a Thriver!”

So that really helped me find clarity that I do want to change careers – as scary and exciting as that may be! The idea of buying textbooks and attending lectures again, really light me up – yes I am a bit of a Hermione/nerd! haha

I have found in my city there is one dietetics course that does a fast tracked version that is completed in 4 years rather than 5, plus my boyfriend suggested finding out if the university does summer units so I could finish units faster and I’ve realised I can likely use the electives I completed during my Arts degree and transfer them as credit. It’s still going to realistically be years, but there may be ways to lighten the study load.

Thanks again!

[Rachel E]

Hey Samantha!

I love this chat with your 80-year-old self! Thank you for sharing. 🙂 I’m so glad it was helpful!

And as a fellow Hermione/nerd, I totally understand your excitement about the prospect of going back to school. 😉

It’s great that you can fast track that particular dietetics course, if you want to. I’m curious about whether you’re sold on being a dietician as your route? If so, that’s great! But if you’re open to other routes that encompass health/wellness/diet, I wonder what you might think of nutritionist programs or even health coaching. I think both are less intensive, which might have pros and cons (pro, in that it wouldn’t take as much time; con, in that you might not learn as much as you want to). There’s no right or wrong choice here. There’s only what feels right, to you! But it could be worth exploring all of the related options; even if all it does is confirm your commitment to dietetics, then that would still be useful!

[SamanthaLenkic]

Hi Rachel,

Thank you for your reply, yes I have looked at a number of options and have settled on dietetics for a number of reasons. I have been researching this pathway for a while and at least in Australia the term nutritionist is not a regulated term. As a result the quality of nutritionists vary greatly, some have only done online courses for a couple of weeks and call themselves nutritionists.

I’ve seen a ‘nutritionist’ go on one of our TV morning shows and talk about a ‘study’ that said eating chocolate daily made you lose weight – seriously. Now it turns out this study was a prank (to make a point about the media not researching nutrition studies before reporting on them), and this ‘nutritionist’ was not qualified to read the medical literature or comment on this study – but she just wanted her face on the TV. Health coaches tends to have the same problem, it’s even more vague than a nutritionist and for me it’s just not a credible health profession – I know that sounds harsh, but that’s truly how I feel about them.

A dietitian is more regulated and more respected within the industry, plus has to be university educated. There are also more job opportunities for dieticians since they can do everything a nutritionist can do, I have a family friend who is a lecturer in nutrition at a university and she strongly recommended not becoming a nutritionist due to the job market and credibility.

One thing I thought of doing while I study is be a nutrition or food assistant in a health setting, this doesn’t require qualifications beyond a food handling certificate, but is a good way to start working in the nutrition and dietetics industry before being fully qualified.

[Rachel E]

Hey Samantha!

Awesome, I’m glad you’re clear about why you want to pursue dietetics! It sounds like pursuing that path matches with a lot of your core values and will give you the credibility and stability that you’re looking for. And I like the idea about finding an assistant-type position while you’re studying! Any way that we can start doing what we’re interested in now, rather than have to wait until we’re fully educated, is awesome. I’ve never loved the idea of delaying our satisfaction until we’ve checked all the boxes! Keep us posted! 🙂

[DanaZumaeta]

Hi Rachel & Kristen,

First and foremost, thank you so much! I have loved this short course, my mind has been opened in a way it hasn’t before. I have taken many career / personality tests trying to find my purpose, and this has been the most helpful so far.

Now to my question – I have been able to narrow down my career choices to a small list, but I am not sure if I am capturing everything or if I have the right list. I would love your expert opinion to help guide me to a little bit more smaller list? Or confirmation that I am on the right track?

I am a Firestarter and I believe I have a secondary profile – thriver or side hustler (thriver as I like to ‘clock out’ and have fun but I also have multiple passions / need to ‘do it all’).

My top values that I matched the below careers to (in order of importance): flexibility (fluid hours, can work from anywhere), creativity (creation mostly, artistic), meaningful impact, fun, collaboration/connection.

– Photographer
– Personal trainer & dietitian/nutritionist
– Author
– Digital Designer (web designer / interior designer)
– Online high school teacher (future option… curriculum developer?)

Thank you so much for any guidance / help!
Dana

[Rachel E]

Hi Dana!

I’m so glad that you’ve had a good time in the PPSC so far! 🙂 I can definitely help you think about how to narrow down your options.

But first, keep in mind that I don’t think there’s necessarily a “right” or a “wrong” answer to this question. I think the best way of looking at this question is, “What’s the next right step?” You can always change your mind later, or evolve to a point where you naturally complete a path and are ready to begin a new one! Also, there’s no saying that you necessarily MUST choose one. You can have something that earns you money and things that you do on the side. And if you tend to be multi-passionate, then that might be healthy and good for you!

So, here’s my idea for how you can start weighing these options — Create a grid (like an Excel spreadsheet, even!) where your career options are listed vertically and your values are listed horizontally across the top. Then go through each career option and rank 1-10 (10 being the highest) how much each option can possibly fulfill each value. I know that this is a very simplistic, logical way of doing this! And it’s not meant to be an end-all-be-all exercise; more so, I see it as a way of taking all of your thoughts and channeling them in a way where you can more easily compare the differences.

Then, after doing this, I might delve into the way you ranked things by asking some pointed questions like, “Why is this a 7? What would have made it a 9 or 10?” and “What would have to change for this to be ranked higher?”

I might also use my rankings as a jumping off point to examine the pros and cons of each, as well as the best-case and worst-case scenarios that might arise from pursuing any of those options. Like I might do some free writing about, “What’s an ideal ‘day in the life’ if pursue this path?” and “What’s a bad ‘day in the life’ {or days, plural. Sometimes bad stretches last for a long time!}?”

On that note, I think it’s really important to consider the day-to-day minutia of what any of your options would be like. Often certain things sound fun from the outside, but the day-to-day grind is still going to be present. So what would the day-to-day grind be like for each of these options? What are the less-than-fun tasks you’d have to do for each? Sometimes the easiest way to discern the best fit is to figure out which drudgery you’re most willing to accept!

Let me know what you think after you’ve delved into this some more! 🙂

[BrianneGrzywacz]

Hey Rachel and Kristin!!

How are you guys? 😀 I hope y’all are having a great day! Soooo… I think I have finally figured out what my Primary and Secondary Passion Profiles are… I think it boiled down to Thriver/Side Hustler… I have a wide range of interests, are excited and are curious about a lot of things, but I also value stability, security and comfort. That is a must when it comes to my career. If I don’t have that – I will go insane lol. I do want to share something, before I ask what I wanted to ask… I have been in a mental rut about one of my natural talents, which is art… I have put sooo much mental stress on “I need to have a creative career”, but that means being This or That, when really, I have no idea what the future holds for one lol, and I need to relax lol… Like, I have thought, “Oh, am I meant to be an actor?? Or a movie director??” But, I imagined that because I have always drawn when I was little, have always been bright-eyed and creative, yet pretty shy and introverted. I still think, that despite my doubts, if I really wanted to go to an art school – I would’ve done it by now. I’m still confused by my art, and whether or not I’m supposed to pursue it or not… I definitely don’t feel like drawing lol, but I like the idea of having inspiration behind my art/expressions. I still think to myself, “If I really wanted to be a photographer, I would have been half-way finished with my degree by now, and have wanted to go for it.” I would have felt soo passionate about it, I would’ve went for it! I have thought about dabbling into a few things… But, I just don’t have inspiration or desire to do anything artsy unless I “feel like it”, and even that doesn’t feel like ENOUGH.

Okay, to get to my question I wanted to ask lol… So, one of Thriver’s natural attributes and strengths is “great in Support roles”… any ideas of what that would be or look like? What kind of jobs/careers revolve around Support roles? Also – just out of curiosity (and for fun!), do any of y’all believe in Angel Numbers? 🙂

[DanaZumaeta]

Thank you Rachel! I did what you suggested and I ended with the three I felt in my gut from the beginning. I plan to work on doing all three of these things – Digital design, photography, and writing.

Thank you again!

[Kristen W]

Hi Brianne! Since you’re primarily a Thriver, I wonder if art might be what you’re most passionate about, but not necessarily what you want to do as your career (or at least not as a full-time career)? It sounds like you enjoy art for the pure fun and creative expression that it brings you. And even though you’ve thought about more traditional artistic jobs many times before, the motivation to turn your art into a career hasn’t fully been there. Like you said, you don’t usually have the desire to create art unless you’re feeling inspired, so if you HAD to do it every day in order to collect a paycheck, the Thriver part of you might start to resent your art. By not pursuing artistic jobs, you might have been subconsciously protecting your art by not putting pressure on it to fund your entire life.

Now, that doesn’t mean you won’t still be drawn to jobs or companies that are somewhat creative — that would be totally natural, since you’re such a creative person by nature! As a Thriver (with some Side Hustler mixed in), you’ll likely be happiest at a job that’s fun, low-stress, secure, and allows you to work with supportive, likeminded people … and that also allows you to do the things you’re MOST passionate about (like creating your art) outside of work whenever you feel like it with no pressure.

To answer your question … the reason we say that Thrivers tend to love being support roles is that most Thrivers don’t want a ton of responsibility in their day job (they’d rather save their energy for their outside-of-work pursuits!), which means they tend to be less comfortable in leadership or management roles. Not that they couldn’t do those jobs — it’s just that it might feel like a lot of pressure and responsibility, and they’d rather not have that much stress at work. So when we say “support roles,” we mostly just mean non-leadership/management roles. Anything that allows you to come in, do what you enjoy/are good at, and then clock out (literally and also mentally) will likely sound most appealing to you.

Hope that helps! Oh, and yes I love Angel Numbers! I see them on license plates (and other random places) all the time. They always seem to show up right when I need them. 🙂

[BrianneGrzywacz]

Heyy Kristen!

Yeah, I’m still trying to figure out what is going on with my art – my sister has told me, “I think you’re passion is your art. You just look at it in a negative light”… and Kristen, I literally don’t know completely why that is? I don’t want to force my artistic talent or anything… I like singing, and other realms of art (fine art or expressive). I also despise deadlines when it comes to putting pressure on my creative side/art, that’s how I felt in high school! My teacher was like, “do it like this, oh and don’t forget it’s due on this date!” And I would suck at deadlines! Lol!

How ironic that you mentioned what Thrivers prefer because I was thinking about that last night! Like, omg am I meant to be in a leadership type position? That discourages me because I don’t know if I would like it?! And I agree with those values when it comes to honoring the Thriver in me… I just have never been put in situations or experiences, really, that express those values, so it’s hard to foresee what role (career/jobs) I will be in that honors those values…

I know I was gonna say “don’t like too much responsibility” but I was ignoring that preference because “it sounded bad” lol. But it’s time to start accepting what I truly want… not what they people think I need. Oh okay – that gives me more perspective…. what career examples would you say are non-leadership/management roles?

Omg I am OBSESSED with Angel Numbers!!! I see 222 EVERYWHERE! It stands for balance, new beginnings, and to trust that you’re on the right path :))) in fact, when I was at the event you guys held the other night, I saw 222 that night!! Confirmation from my spirit guides/Angels/loved ones from the Other Side that I am doing the right thing for myself! I love learning about different avenues of New Age spirituality! I was reading about my Photographic Aura yesterday and it’s so ironic what it said! ???? (Can’t remember right now lol plus I’m on break at work so I can’t remember what it said ???? But it was true stuff! That I can relate to as well 🙂

[Kristen W]

Hi Brianne! It totally makes sense why you feel that way about your art. It’s 100% OK to not want to put pressure on your creativity! You’re allowed to enjoy being creative and making art ONLY when and how you feel like it. Clearly putting deadlines or restrictions or any kind of pressure on it ruins the fun for you, and that’s perfectly normal.

There are countless jobs that fall under the non-leadership/management category — I would say any job where you’re not the sole person in charge of a team of people or an entire project would count. For example, in a marketing team there might be multiple team members who each have their own specialization (writing, graphics, sales, web development, etc.), and each person is supporting the team in a different way, whereas the team leader is managing the entire team/project. Does that make sense? So if you get to focus on the thing you enjoy/are good at, without worrying about being responsible for a bunch of other people or the success of the entire team/project, I would consider that a “non-management job.”

Hope that’s helpful! Oh, and I just saw 444 right before posting this. 😉

[BrianneGrzywacz]

Good afternoon Kristen!! 😀

Happy Sunday! Yes – all of this is very helpful!! Thank you so much!! I do have another question revolving around support positions… I think what I meant to ask, was, what kind of support roles would Thrivers enjoy (and with pay), that don’t revolve around (the stress of) leadership/management positions? I have thought about management roles before – owning my own business, which is why I majored in Business Management online, (but never finished – courses were too fast-paced)… But, the responsibility of everything else, – I imagine there probably is a whole lot that goes into Business Management/Owning your own business/Leading a group… But, how do I know if I would feel that “exciting drive/positive motivation” despite those pressures… or resent it? I know there is no such thing as “that perfect job, there is going to be some level of stress – but i’m talking about the type of stress that won’t leave you feeling depressed, out of place, angry (unhealthy, basically lol).
According to my full name – I am a number 9 in Numerology, which means Humanitarianism, and serving and uplifting others… Again, though, rises my concerns… :/ (I don’t mean to boast, – mind if I share a cool piece of info?) – “According to Numerology, People with the 9 energy’s purpose is for the greatest good of all. They have a protective energy and they have a great power and love in their soul. They are aware that they have come with a mission that adheres to the principle of Universal Love and compassion. They will grow and learn throughout their lifetime tolerance, compassion, selflessness and generosity. There is a great strength of character within the 9 person, as well as wisdom, intuition and high idealism (My name actually has those strengths attached to it :). There is also a great deal of warmth of feeling and love of home, family, and friends.” – I feel I am still evolving, and learning about myself, but I agree with this… My Soul just hasn’t fully expressed it, which is why I probably am still questioning I guess?… Anyway, I could go ON about this stuff! Lol, sorry!

My other concern is…. and this has been in my head for some time, but it’s been in the background… How do I know if any type of art is what I want to pursue… if I don’t want (or do??) fame/to be known from it? I know that being the center of attention is not for me, I am very subtle with how I put myself out there artistically… I don’t put it out there like, “Look at me! I’m in the spotlight!” type of way… it’s more of a modest, personal, quiet way… if that makes any sense… For example, I have thought about starting a photography business… or putting sayings on coffee cups cuz I love coffee lol (just a thought lol) But, I imagine taking pictures of random people – families, portrait shots… and I don’t feel any excitement?? I don’t feel that drive or inspiration to connect with random people with photography? But, then again – I don’t know because I’ve never tried it? But, those thoughts go through my mind when I imagine being a busy photographer… Now, if it was people I am close to, have fun with, love – then I would most likely feel inspired to create things… I am trying to really be true to myself as far as my creativity goes… What would I truly want to do, creatively? Do I want to make a living somehow of it? But, I’m afraid to invest in a business, and then turns out, I hate it? But, would if, the more I invest my creativity in it, the more I enjoy it? But, then would if i get bored super quickly with it and want to move on to something else? Do you see what I mean?

And yes, I know what you mean by being part of an integral team – putting your unique talents to work 🙂 I am just trying to think…. What do I really enjoy? What really excites me that I can make a stable, fun, exciting, laidback career out of? I am not sure if being busy all the time would be invigorating for me, or frustrating/irritating? And I am not quite sure how to answer that question… any advice? :/

I do want to say, that after I left that event you guys held Tuesday night – I left sooo happy!! Because, I felt like part of a group that supported what I was looking for all along, and what I believed in! It felt like I was part of a “Passion group” or something?? You know?? And so, I pondered that as well.. Like, would I want to be a part of something like this, and somehow get paid doing it? But, how? lol…. So many questions! =P

I hope all of this isn’t too much to ask… I am just trying to get clear on what I should pursue… and be committed and consistent with it. I don’t want to waste anymore time or money, and because I’ve been unsure for years… I have wasted time and money :/

Oh my gosh really?! 444 is an amazing number!! Means the Angels are with you!!! =D They support you and your journey!! How cool!! I could talk about Angel numbers, dreams, Mediums, Soul evolvement alllll day!

Lol – Okay, so (deep breath!) let me refresh all of my questions…
1.) How do I know if art is something I truly want to pursue, big or small (as a side business, for example) without draining the fun/creativity/inspiration out of it?
2.) I am struggling with what really excites me/passionate about that I can make a good living doing?
3.) Could I get paid being part of a passion group (example – supporting what you guys do as work)? Lol… weird question, but had to ask… don’t know if you could get paid being part of a passion group, unless you’re leading it yourself? (I LOVED being part of something I truly had faith in/believing in/connecting with others on)
4.) What kind of Support roles would Thrivers enjoy, that don’t necessarily have to be Leadership type positions?

Talk soon!

Brianne 🙂

P.S – So sorry this is a BOOK long lol – I just like to get all of my thought out there!

[Kristen W]

Hey Brianne!

You shared so many great thoughts! I’m going to answer your questions the way you numbered them:

1) When it comes to your art, it seems clear that you don’t want to put a lot of pressure on it. You don’t want strict deadlines or restrictions — you just want to create what inspires you and feels good. Which also makes me think that asking your art to fund your life probably isn’t the best idea for you (at least right now). So while you might end up turning your art into a side business, I wouldn’t start with that. Start by simply giving yourself a few hours a week of “no expectations creative time” (I wrote a blog about this topic you can read here). For now, don’t put any pressure on your art to “be something” or turn out a certain way. And you don’t even have to limit yourself to one medium! Play around with your art, and allow your curiosity and inspiration to lead the way, instead of your logical mind. Then see where it takes you over time.

2) I was so happy to see that you signed up for our other program (the PPVE) because we’re going to be helping you answer this exact question throughout that course! So while I have SO MUCH to say on this topic, you can trust that you will have answers to this question at the end of the PPVE. So excited you decided to join us! 🙂

3) Again, it’s awesome that you joined us for the PPVE, because you really WILL be part of a passion group there. So that was a great step in this direction. In terms of getting paid to be involved in something like this, it’s absolutely possible for you to be an administrative assistant or graphic designer or project coordinator or any number of other jobs for a business you love who’s doing great work in the world. I know a LOT of entrepreneurs/business owners in the self-help/spiritual/personal-growth world who have virtual teams to support their business. That could be an interesting option for you! Then you wouldn’t be in charge of the whole business, but you could support a person/team/mission that you really believe in. Just an idea!

4) I gave a few examples of Thriver-esque support roles in #3 above, and it’s hard to come up with examples because there are SO MANY. Literally, anything that allows you to do your work without being responsible for an entire project or people counts. A few super broad examples are things like assistants, coordinators, specialists, creatives, etc. There is no such thing as a “Thriver job,” and I don’t want to give you overly specific examples because I don’t want to limit your options — any job/company that aligns with the values of a Thriver and that also intersects with your natural interests would probably be a good fit.

Again, we’ll be getting more into WHAT you’re passionate about in the PPVE (vs. this course, which was about HOW your passion and career intersect), so I’m excited you decided to join us! 🙂

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